goddi Posted December 20, 2011 Report Share Posted December 20, 2011 Greetings,I have uploaded a slideshow to Beechbrook called Ziplining-Chiang Mai.zip. It is a very large file that Bill has graciously allowed me to upload for a short time. The file is about 350Mbs. It is large because it is a mix of images and video. I know many will not even consider downloading it but I think such large files are the 'wave' of the future. I compressed and edited everything down as much as I could. The video was taken with my Nikon D7000, hand-held, as I dangled from the ropes. So apologizes for the shaky results (my first attempt at video), but it might add to the 'adventurous' look. Next time, I'd like to use the Hero video camera and just strap it to my helmet or chest. The 'slideshow' last about 8.5 minutes. It is 1920x1080. I hope you just turn up the sound and enjoy.Comments and critiques are welcomed.http://www.beechbrook.com/pte/ Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lin Evans Posted December 21, 2011 Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,Looks like fun was had by all! Nice show - makes one feel like they might know how a Gibbon feels!!Best regards,Lin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted December 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,Looks like fun was had by all! Nice show - makes one feel like they might know how a Gibbon feels!!Best regards,Lin=================Lin,Thanks. I did feel like a monkey!One of the challenges was working with the video. I tried to get the file sizes down to a more manageable size, and retain enough quality. I think I read here to let PTE convert the video files first, then do the editing. So I did that. I started out with an MOV and PTE converted it to an AVI. For example, one MOV video of 133 Mbs converted down to an AVI of about 82 Mbs. Then, I edited out the unwanted sections using FreeMake Video Convert to reduce it down to 13 Mbs. But I am not sure what is happening in FreeMake. When in FreeMake, in order to save it after the editing process, I selected the AVI format (to keep it in the same format as the PTE converted format) and also selected the output parameters as 'Same as Source'. I would expect that if I did not edit out any of the AVI video and just resaved it as an AVI, there would be no or little change in file size. However, I did a test by not editing out any of the video and just saved the file as an AVI (selecting 'Same as Source'), but I was surprised that the file size of 55 Mb was reduced in size to 20 Mb, with some lose in quality. If the AVI is saved with the AVI parameters to be 'Same as Source' in FreeMake, why would the file size be reduced? So I am wondering if these steps are reasonable.Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lin Evans Posted December 21, 2011 Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,Not being familiar with the software, I'm not certain what may have happened, but file size is determined by multiple factors. Once you have reduced the size of the input still images to no larger than your intended display and use a reasonable compression, there is little more that can be done with them. Video, on the other hand, has a number of parameters which affect overall file size. It could be that even though the "parameters" are said to be "same as source" the compression level may be greater, or the bitrate may not be "variable". Just what "parameters" are being duplicated is often a question. When you save or convert a video with PTE using "best quality" the bitrate is variable. It "could" be that your software sampled and chose a lower bitrate as the "same" parameter. PTE uses a low bitrate when it doesn't affect quality and a higher one for parts of a video which need it for optimal quality. These factors might account for the small loss of quality you mention.Best regards,Lin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted December 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,Not being familiar with the software, I'm not certain what may have happened, but file size is determined by multiple factors. Once you have reduced the size of the input still images to no larger than your intended display and use a reasonable compression, there is little more that can be done with them. Video, on the other hand, has a number of parameters which affect overall file size. It could be that even though the "parameters" are said to be "same as source" the compression level may be greater, or the bitrate may not be "variable". Just what "parameters" are being duplicated is often a question. When you save or convert a video with PTE using "best quality" the bitrate is variable. It "could" be that your software sampled and chose a lower bitrate as the "same" parameter. PTE uses a low bitrate when it doesn't affect quality and a higher one for parts of a video which need it for optimal quality. These factors might account for the small loss of quality you mention.Best regards,Lin[/quote==================================Lin,I took a took at the various bitrates of one of my videos, using the Properties/Detail tab. There are 2 parameters, Total Bitrate and Data Rate.1- The original MOV file's Total Bitrate is 22,655 kbps and the Data Rate is 21,083.2- After it was 'converted' to an AVI by PTE, the Total Bitrate is 12,899 kbps and the Data Rate is 12,643.3- After it was only saved (without any editing) in Freemake (selecting the 'Same' parameters), the Total Bitrate is 4,659 and the Data Rate is 4,403.In Freemake, the Bitrate was set to 'Auto', but I see I can set my own Bitrate.So I did an test to see what if I saved the 'converted' AVI file using Freemake and set the 'Bitrate' to 12,899 (the Total Bitrate as was in the Properties/Details tab).The result is the saved 'converted' AVI files shows a Total Bitrate of 13,219 and a Data Rate of 12,899.Very interesting results. So you must be on to something that I did not have any clue about. At least with Freemake, their 'Bitrate' translates to the Data Rate in the Properties/Data tab, and the chosen Bitrate has a lot to do with the final file size. Thanks very much for shedding some light on this.By the way, which program do you use to edit your videos? And what bitrate do you choose for your final parameter?Thanks... Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin hill Posted December 21, 2011 Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,A brilliant show, the video showing all the action and what it is like ziplining.I loved the section where you had the 3 videos, very well done. The videos were very clear in my opinion.We did some ziplining in the Caribbean, a wonderful experience. Not so good when you do notquite make it to the platform and you have to resort to pulling yourself up to the platform.Thank you for sharing a wonderful adventure.Colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lin Evans Posted December 21, 2011 Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,Unfortunately, I can't afford to buy the software I would like to use anymore so for video editing, I use the free version of VideoPad Video Editor. I generally save the output from my edits in VideoPad in MP4 format, then let PTE do its variable bitrate conversion using 100% quality on the slider - but that's only if I'm using a high resolution video. Many of my video inserts are rather tiny and used for special effects such as fire animation or other output from Particleillusions which don't really need super high video quality because the viewer can't see any difference regardless of bitrate, etc. You may want to read this link if you haven't already seen it: Scroll to the bottom and read Igor's comments about h.264, etc. I suspect that the same variable bitrate is used in the PTE conversions to AVI though I haven't verified this with Igor....http://www.picturest...0225#entry90225Best regards,LinThanks very much for shedding some light on this.By the way, which program do you use to edit your videos? And what bitrate do you choose for your final parameter?Thanks... Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted December 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,Unfortunately, I can't afford to buy the software I would like to use anymore so for video editing, I use the free version of VideoPad Video Editor. I generally save the output from my edits in VideoPad in MP4 format, then let PTE do its variable bitrate conversion using 100% quality on the slider - but that's only if I'm using a high resolution video. Many of my video inserts are rather tiny and used for special effects such as fire animation or other output from Particleillusions which don't really need super high video quality because the viewer can't see any difference regardless of bitrate, etc. You may want to read this link if you haven't already seen it: Scroll to the bottom and read Igor's comments about h.264, etc. I suspect that the same variable bitrate is used in the PTE conversions to AVI though I haven't verified this with Igor....http://www.picturest...0225#entry90225Best regards,Lin==============================Lin,Thanks for the link. I had read it before but I did not mean much to me. But now, it has more meaning. Igor's advise to not worry about Bitrate is pointed toward creating the MP4s where he says, "I recommend use 'Quality' parameter when you output H.264 video. Not 'Bitrate' parameter."Our previous postings have to do with saving a video file in an editing program and choosing a different Bitrate. I actually have VideoPad but have not really used it. But I just gave it a go. However, I can not find a menu that will allow me to choose my own Bitrate setting, as I can in FreeMake (also a free program). When I saved the same unedited PTE converted video file mentioned in previous posting (where the file size=55 Mb; Total Bitrate=12,899 kbps; and the Data Rate=12,643), the VideoPad results were: file size=30 Mb; Total Bitrate=7123; Data Bitrate=6803. But I don't see anywhere in VideoPad to control the Bitrate. Is there a menu in VideoPad where we can adjust the Bitrate?Another strange thing. In my recently made slideshow with MOV videos, when I dragged down the video files into the Slide List, PTE automatically went through the 'conversion' process for all the videos. I didn't see the menu to adjust the quality slider scale to 100%. Now with a new slideshow with MP4 videos, when I bring a video down to the Slide List, it does not automatically go into the 'conversion' process. I can right click and manually choose the Convert Video Clip and adjust the quality slider to 100%. Can you tell me why I saw two different ways that PTE converted the video files?Added later: Oh...now I see something. When I drag down an MOV or AVI video, it automatically goes into the converting, but just gives me only the choice of 'Optimize' or "Use Original File". But with MP4 videos, I can bring it into the Slide List and then choose Convert Video Clip and have access to the Quality slider. Why is it doing this????Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted December 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,A brilliant show, the video showing all the action and what it is like ziplining.I loved the section where you had the 3 videos, very well done. The videos were very clear in my opinion.We did some ziplining in the Caribbean, a wonderful experience. Not so good when you do notquite make it to the platform and you have to resort to pulling yourself up to the platform.Thank you for sharing a wonderful adventure.Colin==================Colin,Wow..."Brilliant"? Thanks very much for taking a look at it and your comments. I actually took those 3 videos with the video camera rotated 90 degrees to get the 'tall' view. I was wondering if I would be able to rotate them back to vertical. I think I did it in the video editing process (FreeMake Video Converter). Or I could have done it in PTE too. I was worried if it could be done but it worked out. Having a little extra 'weight' helps zipping all the way to the platform. Thanks... Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithrg Posted December 21, 2011 Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Great show Gary, I think if I turned up my heat and turned on the ceiling fan,I could have almost been there with you.Thanks for sharing, looks like a lot of fun, gayland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lin Evans Posted December 21, 2011 Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,It's all there in Video Pad. When you click on "Save Movie" then from the popup menu "Video Output Setup" when you choose your file format you have a wide range of options. Depending on what you choose for an encoder, etc., you will have different choices. In some cases bitrate will be a choice and in other encoders you have no choice of bitrate but rather "quality," etc. You'll just need to play with it. Essentially, create yourself a tiny video clip and use it with the different options you have on your system. These will vary depending on installed software. Video encoders are much like audio codecs in that you may have a few or many depending on which ones reside on your individual computer. This is greatly different and depends on installed software and whether or not you have purposely installed things like DivX, QuickTime, etc. I can't answer for Igor about MOV/AVI and MP4 differential treatment, but I'm certain there are very good reasons for this and they likely have to do with the individual video encoders and envelopes used.Best regards,Lin==============================Lin,Thanks for the link. I had read it before but I did not mean much to me. But now, it has more meaning. Igor's advise to not worry about Bitrate is pointed toward creating the MP4s where he says, "I recommend use 'Quality' parameter when you output H.264 video. Not 'Bitrate' parameter."Our previous postings have to do with saving a video file in an editing program and choosing a different Bitrate. I actually have VideoPad but have not really used it. But I just gave it a go. However, I can not find a menu that will allow me to choose my own Bitrate setting, as I can in FreeMake (also a free program). When I saved the same unedited PTE converted video file mentioned in previous posting (where the file size=55 Mb; Total Bitrate=12,899 kbps; and the Data Rate=12,643), the VideoPad results were: file size=30 Mb; Total Bitrate=7123; Data Bitrate=6803. But I don't see anywhere in VideoPad to control the Bitrate. Is there a menu in VideoPad where we can adjust the Bitrate?Added later: Oh...now I see something. When I drag down an MOV or AVI video, it automatically goes into the converting, but just gives me only the choice of 'Optimize' or "Use Original File". But with MP4 videos, I can bring it into the Slide List and then choose Convert Video Clip and have access to the Quality slider. Why is it doing this????Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted December 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gary,It's all there in Video Pad. When you click on "Save Movie" then from the popup menu "Video Output Setup" when you choose your file format you have a wide range of options. Depending on what you choose for an encoder, etc., you will have different choices. In some cases bitrate will be a choice and in other encoders you have no choice of bitrate but rather "quality," etc. You'll just need to play with it. Essentially, create yourself a tiny video clip and use it with the different options you have on your system. These will vary depending on installed software. Video encoders are much like audio codecs in that you may have a few or many depending on which ones reside on your individual computer. This is greatly different and depends on installed software and whether or not you have purposely installed things like DivX, QuickTime, etc. I can't answer for Igor about MOV/AVI and MP4 differential treatment, but I'm certain there are very good reasons for this and they likely have to do with the individual video encoders and envelopes used.Best regards,Lin======================Lin,Ok...I see it now. Sometimes I can't see the forest for the trees. Nothing is 'standard' so you have to really have to be on your toes to pick up all these nuances in different programs. It will take a lot of testing to see what works best but now I see more of what I should be seeing in these programs.Thanks...Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted December 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Great show Gary, I think if I turned up my heat and turned on the ceiling fan, I could have almost been there with you.Thanks for sharing, looks like a lot of fun, gayland.==============Gayland... You'll need a monkey or two on the couch, too. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted December 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hello:Great experience on that trip!!!. Splendid nature and spinning sensations. Very entertaining presentation.I also loved the music. What song is it?moritz=======================Moritz,Thanks. Yes, it was a great adventure. I couldn't believe how high we were in the trees.The music? I 'borrowed' it from the ads for the Hero2 video camera. I like watching their ads just to hear the music. (I want their camera, too!)http://gopro.com/I hope they don't mind.... Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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