PGA Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 I have encountered a totally weird problem with the playback of audio using v7.5.4 and have re-created it using v7.5.7. The situation is as follows:- the sequence plays correctly in the mini-player- the sequence plays correctly using the Preview button- the sequence plays incorrectly after it has been published as an EXE for PC.The sequence comprises 51 slides - no video clips but some PNG images used as "picture in picture" and four Tracks of audio.Track1 has seven sound files and each cross-fades into the next using PTE's default cross-fades. This track starts and ends with music and has ambience recordings in between.Track2 has ten sound files, each one being a piece of the narrator's voice-overTrack3 has eight sound files, each one being a piece of the first actor's voice-overTrack4 has just one sound file, the piece of voice-over from the second actorThe problem manifests itself as follows:If playback of the EXE is initiated and then all is left alone only the first four pieces of Track2 are heard. Nothing is heard of any of the items on Tracks 1, 3 and 4. However, if after the playback starts, the spacebar is used to pause the playback and then the right arrow key is used to advance to a slide that sits alongside a piece of sound off Track 2, the playback is then correct. Tracks1 and 2 are now both heard, in proper synchronization with one another and with the slides. It is also now possible to step back through the slides and get the correct playback until, working backwards, the first slide that should have the music on Track1 playing with it. It is impossible to get that piece of music to playback. Also, at the end of Track1 the same piece of music is used to run with the closing credits. This use of the music is never heard during playback of the EXE file.So the problem seems to be associated with that particular music file. But that music file plays perfectly through both the mini-viewer and the Preview button so there is clearly nothing wrong with it.Please note: I am NOT prepared to change the piece of music as there clearly is nothing wrong with it. What I will be prepared to do is to build the soundtrack in Audacity rather than in PTE. I will also, for the time being, feel compelled to warn users of PTE v7.5 that there are still some problems associated with more complex soundtracks assembled using the audio features of PTE.regards,Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Igor Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Peter,Can you reproduce this problem in a new project with as posssible smaller number of slides and audio files?Please send me source files of a test project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGA Posted April 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Hi Igor,I have reduced the project down to just the opening music piece and the slides. The project plays correctly in the mini-player and under Preview button but not as a built EXE file. Because of the music file content, the zip file is too large to upload to the forum website so I've uploaded it to Dropbox.regards,PeterEdited by PGA 6th April 2013 at 12:05GMT: Removed Dropbox link because the target file held copyrighted material.P.S. Igor, if you didn't download the file before I removed the link, let me know and I'll send you the link in a PM or e-mail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Yachtsman1 Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Hi PeterDownloaded your file & had a quick look, one thing that stands out is the sound file being a WAV file???Regards EricYachtsman1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGA Posted April 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Eric,It is my understanding that when one uses the Preview button, PTE publishes a temporary EXE file and then runs that. The whole concept of Preview should be "what you see and hear is what you will get when you Publish". Right now, with my project, that is not the case. If I cannot rely on the Exe coming out the same as the previewed version, then PTE is no longer "fit for purpose". If there is something wrong with the WAV file, PTE has to flag that up at either mini-player time or at Preview time. If there is nothing wrong with the WAV, PTE has to include it properly in the Published EXE. Right now, PTE does neither.As to the file being a WAV file: that should be the simplest kind of file for PTE to handle. It requires no decoding before it can be played back.regards,Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Yachtsman1 Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 PeterIt has always been my understanding that PTE doesn't like WAV files, particularly if mixed with MP3's. Your other comments I cannot research as I don't use 7.5 or PTE's sound editor.Regards Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Note the message at the bottom of the WAV Properties .It might be refering to PGA's computer though."The file came from another computer.........might be blocked to protect this computer".DGP.S. I'm getting the same problem as Gary - not being able to attach files to posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Hi Igor,I have reduced the project down to just the opening music piece and the slides. The project plays correctly in the mini-player and under Preview button but not as a built EXE file. Because of the music file content, the zip file is too large to upload to the forum website so I've uploaded it to Dropbox here: https://dl.dropbox.c...13_12-24-49.zipregards,Peter======================================Peter,I imported your original wav file into Audacity and just exported it as a wav file. Made no changes or adjustments. I switched the wav files and created an exe with the new wav file. It played just fine. I took a look at your wav file with MediaInfo. The only difference (see attachment) between the two wav files is that the original wav files has two additional components: ITOC (table of contents) and ITRK (track number). I think this has to do with informational tags that are created when a file is ripped from a CD into a wav file.If you did rip the wav from a CD, this might be the problem. This is just a shot in the dark because I really don't have a clue but this what I found.Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 I've just made the same experiment with the wav-file, as Gary did. The result is the same as Gary's.Regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 There is obviously something "wrong" or different with PGA's WAV.I can replace it with just about any WAV from my computer and a full working EXE can be reproduced.But just importing into Audition etc and re saving is not the answer.Why is this particular WAV giving this particular problem??DG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 ...But just importing into Audition etc and re saving is not the answer....You may be right. But there have been similar effects with other audio files in the past (if I remember it correctly, also with MP3s). All we can learn is that Preview and Exe seem to use different audio interfaces. So, if the Preview runs fine, the Exe still has to be tested.Regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 There is obviously something "wrong" or different with PGA's WAV.I can replace it with just about any WAV from my computer and a full working EXE can be reproduced.But just importing into Audition etc and re saving is not the answer.Why is this particular WAV giving this particular problem??DG=========================Dave,Can you take a look at your wav files with MediaInfo and see if they contain the ITOC and ITRK components? If yours contain these components and they play OK in exe, then that is not what was causing the problem.GaryMediaInfo:http://mediainfo.sourceforge.net/en Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Hi Gary,I hope that you don't mind if I decline that?I am dubious about downloading these things - probably unjustifiably - but if there is any other way of getting the same info??DG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Hi Gary,I hope that you don't mind if I decline that?I am dubious about downloading these things - probably unjustifiably - but if there is any other way of getting the same info??DG====================Dave, I don't know if there is any other way to get that info. But this program is really a simple but useful utility program to use. I am always using it to see what the attributes are of video and audio files. Never had a problem.Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGA Posted April 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Why is this particular WAV giving this particular problem??Dave,That is, indeed, the key question. This particular file was ripped from CD using Windows Media Player - as have been all my other music WAV files. I have never come across a situation where any of those WAV files have shown this kind of problem. However..., this is the only sequence I have made where the complex, multi-item sound-track has been assembled solely within PTE v7.5. In the life of this project Tracks have been added and then removed, items have been added to Tracks and then removed, items have been moved from one Track to another, most Tracks have at some point been muted and then unmuted, etc., etc. In short, I have tried to use PTE - and only PTE - to assemble this sequence. Had I not checked that the sequence EXE was OK this morning, I would have looked right idiot at our AV group meeting tonight. As it is, I cannot show this sequence to the members tonight.regards,Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Dave,...As it is, I cannot show this sequence to the members tonight.regards,Peter====================Peter,As a temporary fix, just run it through Audacity and export it as a wav. It should work, at least until we can figure out what actually is causing the problem.Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 You could, if you imported into Audition etc and re-saved from there??That's your choice.However you answered one question - if you did the Ripping yourself then you will not see the message that I see in the Properties of the WAV.See Post 7.I thought that you might have been given the WAV and that it had been ripped on a different computer.Wait a sec' - did you rip the WAV on the same computer as you are assembling the PTE??I use Sonic Stage to do all my CD to MP3 transfers - never had a problem.DG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 You could, if you imported into Audition etc and re-saved from there??That's your choice.However you answered one question - if you did the Ripping yourself then you will not see the message that I see in the Properties of the WAV.See Post 7.I thought that you might have been given the WAV and that it had been ripped on a different computer.Wait a sec' - did you rip the WAV on the same computer as you are assembling the PTE??I use Sonic Stage to do all my CD to MP3 transfers - never had a problem.DG==============================I just did a test. I ripped a cut from a CD using Windows Media Player and saved it as a wav. I looked at it with MediaInfo. The wav contained the ITOC and ITRK components. When put in your show and created an exe, the wav did not play. I ran the wav through Audacity and exported it as a wav and those two components disappeared. I put this wav into your show and the music played.I can't explain why but it looks like those two components might be causing the problem. Perhaps, there is a setting that can be unchecked in WMP to prevent them from being added to the output...I don't know.Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGA Posted April 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Wait a sec' - did you rip the WAV on the same computer as you are assembling the PTE??Yes. I do all preparation and assembly on my desktop system.Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddi Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 ...As to the file being a WAV file: that should be the simplest kind of file for PTE to handle. It requires no decoding before it can be played back.regards,Peter=========================Peter,I can't disagree with you that you should expect that an audio track that is ripped to a wav file should play in PTE. However, I am curious why you bother with creating wav files, and not MP3.If a CD audio track is ripped as an MP3 file, it is smaller and it does not contain the ITRK and ITOC components (that seem to be causing the problem). And it plays in PTE with no problems. Is this a 'quality' issue? Just curious.Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 I hope that this helps:I converted a CD track to WAV in WMP and inserted into PGA's show Demo and got exactly the same symptoms as he got. The EXE would not work.I converted EXACTLY the same track to WAV using Sonic Stage and everything worked as expected.I have never used WMP for this purpose before but I'm sure that others have - I can only report what happened.Vista 32 Bit - my old faithful Sony Laptop - WMP 11.Sonic Stage 4.3 (no longer available??).DG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGA Posted April 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 I confirm that it seems to be the presence of the "metadata" that is the issue. I have opened the file in Audacity and saved as WAV 16bit PCM. The copy produced by Audacity has no metadata at all. This version plays OK in the sequence. I feel that PTE must detect the presence of this offending metadata and warn the user. A program that Previews correctly but then Publishes a fault is going to earn itself a very bad reputation and lose customers.Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 Questions:Is this a DRM issue?Can PTE legally remove DRM for you?Is this something new I.e. have you used WAV files produced this way in the past without problem?DG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertAlbright Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 As Dave implies, this may be a copyright protection issue.If Peter has the correct licences to permit him to playback the work to his club, he should contact the recording company.The licences are available through the IAC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Yachtsman1 Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 IMO it's the copyright music issue chestnut. I did numerous tests trying to remove data from commercial music recordings using every method I could find including so called data stripping software, zilch. No matter what I tried YouTube always flagged it as copyright, which is why I started using copyright free music in projects I wanted to offer generally.Yachtsman1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.